Entry fee for higher class tournament

  
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Thibault de Vassal    (2010-04-24)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Tano-Urayoán just posted an interesting idea in the following discussion:

http://www.ficgs.com/user_page.php?page=forum_read&id=8507

I was totally opposed to this idea at a first sight, but after a while I found some real advantages.

The idea : Any player could pay an entry fee to enter a high class chess tournament (e.g. 20 Euros for class M, 40 for class SM, 60 for class GM), whatever his rating.

Of course what we all see first is : Anyone can pay to make increase his rating faster, that is just unfair!

But let's imagine that a player rated 1800 pays an entry fee of 40 Euros to enter the class SM waiting list.

1) The waiting list will be filled faster!

2) If this player is actually stronger than its rating show, he'll find its place faster (the other players will not lose so many points because their ratings are protected - see rating calculation rules).

3) There could be such an extra rule: Players who are already in the waiting list or who will play the tournament may share 50% of the entry fee in Epoints, which would be a kind of compensation for them.

4) These entry fees will help to have more prizes in free tournaments (another compensation) and bigger prizes in e.g. freestyle cups, although I don't have any idea on how many players would be interested in this, so the site will become more popular and so on...


Anyway, please share your views if you have any idea to improve this one, and your opinion is needed here of course!


Wayne Lowrance    (2010-04-24 20:25:52)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I do not like it. What you will see is a higher bracket classification in the waiting list stage will see presumably some qualified players entry, soon to be filled up with a host of players with deep pockets entering, so it ends up being not a higher bracket but a lower class bracket. This just does not seem fair. It means (as you have already pointed out) players with deep pockets can buy there way into rating points. I will not support or tolerate that notion if I can avoid it.


Scott Nichols    (2010-04-24 23:44:18)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I agree with Wayne totally.


Don Groves    (2010-04-25 01:45:46)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I still like the idea of allowing the winner of a tournament to enter the next higher level one time. It serves the same purpose as this suggestion but is limited to one player at a time so it doesn't dilute the level of play in the higher tournament. It also helps a new player find their appropriate level faster.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-04-25 01:50:10)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Okay, that's what I thought :)

Anyway, the silver games are another way to play stronger players. So that was not necessary in any case.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-04-25 18:50:23)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

By the way it would be possible to set as a limit 1 "sponsoring" player per tournament as well.

Maybe this rule would look like more acceptable if I can make an update so that winners in a tournament get a ticket to entry a higher class tournament.

Once again, I'm not saying I want this "entry fee for higher class tournament" rule at any price, but if we find a way to make it not too unacceptable, maybe it would be worth a try before to see the real consequences so let's discuss it again!


Wayne Lowrance    (2010-04-25 21:47:28)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

OK, were getting closer. How about this:
The winner of a tournament class "just below" the next higher class gets a free ride into that class. No money needed! I sorta think this is ok
Wayne


Wayne Lowrance    (2010-04-25 21:50:58)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Or, maybe you want the money entrance requirement to compensate the "class" players for permitting the entry.
I am ok with this as well
Wayne


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-04-25 22:02:41)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I'm not sure if I understood well your last message, would you have an example?


Michel van der Kemp    (2010-04-27 10:44:40)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

For reasons already mentioned by others I would be opposed to people being able to buy themselves tickets to higher tournaments.

The idea of earning a ticket for a higher tournament by winning a tournament seems fair, and seems similar to what ICCF has. I would be in favour of that idea.


Garvin Gray    (2010-04-27 12:12:19)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

As already stated, I am in favour of the winner of the immediate section below being able to earn a spot in the higher division.

I do have a slight change of position. In previous posts I have stated that in the case of a tie for first, it should be the highest TER that goes through.

Now I think about it, it should be the person with the highest rating at the END of the tournament.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-10 15:16:19)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Well, the discussion continued in another thread :

http://www.ficgs.com/user_page.php?page=forum_read&id=8555

Garvin's ideas may work fine, but while some players will like the benefits, some others will be deceived not to be able to take advantage of it (quite a chancy factor)...

Here is my new proposal (based on a few Epoints, not real money) :

- Winners of any standard (class) or rapid tournament, whatever the game, may buy a ticket for 10 Epoints to enter the waiting list for the next tournament category according the following conditions :

* No more than 2 players obtained the best score in the tournament. There's no winner otherwise.

* The player's TER must not be more than 200 points below the low rating limit of the waiting list.

* At most 2 players may buy a ticket to enter the same waiting list.

* The possibility to buy a ticket is valid up to 2 months after the end of the tournament and only after the official end of the tournament [when the tournaments list shows winners, not leaders of the tournament].

* The player's account must be credited of at least 10 Epoints.


Please correct anything that looks unclear and let's discuss it again :) Thanks for all your help Garvin & all!

I'd like to have Wayne, Michel's & other opinions on the proposed changes, is this at least more acceptable according to you?


Michel van der Kemp    (2010-05-11 16:42:20)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I just dont like the possibility to buy oneself tickets for higher tournaments. What's next? Next FIDE world championship challenger is going to be the one that brings the largest bag of money to the table?

Perhaps a commercial aspect to this justifies this idea. I know it's a lot of work to keep a site like this running, and FICGS gets many improvements all the time. It makes sense to get some revenue out of it, to compensate so much work.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-11 18:01:16)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Hi Michel! Thanks again for discussing it.

> What's next? Next FIDE world championship challenger is going to be the one that brings the largest bag of money to the table?

I don't know if this was designed to be humor (I guess, but maybe you meant FICGS instead of FIDE?) but in the context of current FIDE rules I find it very funny :) .. by the way if the same rules were applied at FICGS, anyone could challenge the champion for the title for $500,000 or something like this. Of course that would be great for FICGS and the current champion may appreciate such a prize as well, but that's not the point here.

However yes this FIDE rule may be compared to my suggestion, at a very different level though (the basic idea is the same: to build prizes for more interesting [free?] competitions), in my opinion an entry fee of 10 Epoints is quite different from what I suggested before already. Note that even if FICGS was not free, it would not justify such special entry fee more (not saying it cannot be justified!), after all there's an entry fee in the vast majority of OTB tournaments, if you don't pay it (but GM/IM that are generally invited to play for free - and most often take the prize), you cannot improve your rating, the problem is that the entry fee depends on the tournament, and the entry fee for closed tournaments (the main/only way to get norms) is often much higer.

I agree that things are somewhat different here as the main idea of FICGS is to be completely free. So the real question is : "Is FICGS still 'free' if a tournament's winner can choose to pay an entry fee in a virtual money (by the way it is quite easy to get Epoints without having to pay anything) to enter the next tournaments category".

- If despite of all the answer is "no", then FICGS is NOT free right now anyway as any player can play a rated 2 games match RAPID SILVER with an entry fee against a higher rated player to have more chances to win elo points. This way even IECG was not free (chessfriend), and even if something is really 100% free, it still doesn't mean fair, which is the main point here. Even if a tournament's winner could enter the next tournament's category for free, such a rule would NEVER be completely fair, as I described the particular cases.

Quite complex :)

Finally I'm not saying you're wrong in any way. Free or not free is a really complex question IMO, in my point of view, FICGS will remain free as noone needs to pay to become champion or to achieve the highest ratings (unlike FIDE). But if it is 99% free only while offering money prizes, I'd choose it anyway for sure.


Benjamin Block    (2010-05-11 18:19:01)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Ficgs is still free... I think it can be very good indeed.

1.Some players maybe want training...

2.It will also stop an inflation. Because some new player came here and already have a high rating from example iccf.
And they start playing this site. Maybe they don´t have time for the games and left this site. With just giving a way some points.
Am i right?


Garvin Gray    (2010-05-11 18:25:23)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Michel van der Kemp - I think you need to read, or re-read all of the comments and proposals, discussions again.

The key feature of this is that a person has to win their own rating group tournament in either standard or rapid before being able to enter a higher division.

There is no case where anyone can just buy a spot into a higher division. They have to first earn the privilege. Then in simple terms they would only be using the epoints collected from their win of said division.

I really do hope you have read the previous comments over the few threads that have eventuated on this topic, as they are crucial to understand the concept.

I have spent quite a lot of time typing out proposals and thoughts on this idea, so if you have not read them and instead just come into the forum and protested at the first thing you think it wrong, then I will be rather pissed off at you and anyone else that does it.


Stephane Legrand    (2010-05-11 18:37:09)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I agree with Garvin, Wayne .... I am in favour of the winner of the immediate section below being able to earn a spot in the higher division.
An i propose that if this player obtains 50% or more he can have a new one in this division.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-11 18:48:52)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Stéphane, please specify if you agree any conditions (which ones?) described a few posts above... that's the main point.

Garvin, I need some opinions like Michel's one (even if I cannot convince him), it helps me to make my ideas clearer and to bring better arguments. I feel that we approach something now, but we really have to specify what conditions we're talking about (e.g. entry fee in Epoints or real money) when discussing. So should I understand that you agree my previous posts?


Stephane Legrand    (2010-05-11 19:09:42)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I was totally opposed to the idea of entry fee at a first sight, but after a while maybe you can propose the 2 solutions for tournaments (entry fee possible or not to enter a high class chess tournament)


Daniel Parmet    (2010-05-11 19:25:22)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I am very much in favor of the winner of his/her own class tournament earning as a prize the right to play one up class. This actually brings a relevant prize to the tournaments! Up until I have had no reason to care if I won a tournament or not. Why? What do I get? Pride? Ego? Bragging Rights? Epoints? I get nothing! Now I earn the right to player stronger players! A true prize indeed!

I don't agree if two players tie though that one just mystically be given the prize and the other not. I understand you don't want to dilute the rating pool... but you can force one person to wait til waiting list fills and each person can sit in it one at a time.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-11 19:34:50)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Stéphane, the point is I cannot add this rule without any entry fee (as explained many posts above or in the other thread).

Daniel, I agree with your last point!


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-11 19:37:04)
6 options

So, to be clearer here are the 6 options :


1) Tournaments winners may entry the next category waiting list according to the conditions described a few posts above and for 10 Epoints.

2) Tournaments winners may entry any higher category's waiting list for 10 to 100 Epoints according to his rating (e.g. 10 Epoints for the next category, 30 for 2 categories above, 60 for 3 categories above, 100 for 4 categories above).

3) Any player may entry the next category's waiting list for 10 Epoints.

4) Any player may entry any higher category's waiting list for 10 to 100 Epoints according to his rating (e.g. 10 Epoints for the next category, 30 for 2 categories above, 60 for 3 categories above, 100 for 4 categories above).

5) Any player may entry any higher category's waiting list for 10 to 100 Euros [not Epoints] according to his rating (e.g. 10 Euros for the next category, 20 for 2 categories above, 40 for 3 categories above, 100 for 4 categories above).

6) No change.


Please choose :)

As for me, while choice #2 looks like a non-sense between my first proposal (choice #5) and my last proposal (choice #1), I feel that choices #1 and #4 could be ok, the #4 may help to build bigger prizes while the #1 is the most fair (after choice #6 of course).

How would you rank these choices?


Daniel Parmet    (2010-05-11 19:39:23)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I very much like option 1. I would also point out that this is the appeal of the WCH tournament. You get to play some stronger players and if you manage to win your group... your prize is even stronger players!


Kamesh Nookala    (2010-05-11 19:57:10)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Dear Thib,

Points 1 and 4 are quite good. However, here comes the question.

What if the winner of the preceding (lower) category, after paying 10 e-points and entering into the next higher rated tour, fares decent enof, for e.g. finishes 2nd in the higher category (or doesn't lose a single game)? Will he have to again win his category of event and then pay 10 e-points and join the immediate higher rated event again? Or, he will "earn" a chance to play that higher rated category again considering his previous performance?


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-11 20:14:40)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Hi Kamesh, I think we should just follow the conditions that I copy again here (valid for choice #1, a tournament winner may buy a ticket if) :


* No more than 2 players obtained the best score in the tournament. There's no winner otherwise.

* The player's TER must not be more than 200 points below the low rating limit of the waiting list.

* At most 2 players may buy a ticket to enter the same waiting list.

* The possibility to buy a ticket is valid up to 2 months after the end of the tournament and only after the official end of the tournament [when the tournaments list shows winners, not leaders of the tournament].

* The player's account must be credited of at least 10 Epoints.


Let's say the winner of a class B tournament then wins a class A tournament after having bought a ticket, he has good chances to see his rating increased after the next rating calculation and before that his possibility to buy a new ticket (for class M) expires. Maybe the possibility to buy a ticket should be valid 3 months, I'm not sure.


Kamesh Nookala    (2010-05-11 20:22:57)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Dear Thib,

All this stuff is way too much for my little 1 kb brain to understand. Whatever, you guys decide, I am prepared for that, coz, you guys wont do things without a genuine reason and a valid discussion !

I will keep on trying to march ahead !


Peter Marriott    (2010-05-11 21:17:18)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I agree with Thib. This is pretty confusing... I'm sure whatever you guys choose will be fine, though! :P


Peter Marriott    (2010-05-11 21:17:56)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

oops, *I agree with Kam


Wayne Lowrance    (2010-05-11 21:53:09)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Away to complicated for many of us.
Wayne


Tano-Urayoan Russi Roman    (2010-05-12 05:58:32)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Option 6 no change at all.
Wayne Lowrence exposed that with hard work you could gain your way to the top


Garvin Gray    (2010-05-12 08:51:01)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

To answer one point, as opposed to point one hehe.

While it is true with hard work and good results, it is possible to get into the very high rating groups, the way this site works makes it very difficult indeed.

In fact, it is more likely that a persons rating will stay the same or reduce due to the fact that more players come into the system, take away rating points from those with established ratings and this keeps happening.

With how this site is set up, there are very few opportunities for players in the 2100 rating group to get back those points by playing opponents in the 2200-2300 or more as it stands atm.

So it is highly likely that a player, or players, could be improving their games, but their rating does not improve because they do not have the opportunity to improve their rating because they do not play people rated above them as much as they are playing people rated below them.


Garvin Gray    (2010-05-12 08:55:30)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Options 1 and 6 are the only options in my opinion.

As I have already commented many times now, if you allow people to just buy their way in, then it creates disadvantages for those without much money and goes against the grain of this whole site.

While I am voting for option 1, if it is a choice between anyone can pay to enter a division up or there are no promotion opportunities at all, I WILL CHANGE MY VOTE TO OPTION 6- NO CHANGE AT ALL.


Garvin Gray    (2010-05-12 08:59:48)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Thib- I really think this voting idea is the wrong direction indeed.

The number of votes that you will receive will be so small as a representative of the whole site that it is not representative at all.

Furthermore, those voting most likely will not have read all of the history, counter-arguments and posts that have been made explaining why things are being proposed.

I am getting quite frustrated at reading some of the posts. I really would just like to see option 1 enacted by yourself, even for a trial period of one year.

One year might seem like a long time, but considering that this rule would only apply from when new tournaments have started, it could take a while for tournament winners to become apparent and then for them to accept their entry and then for those 'going up' to have achieved results that are worthy of analysis.


Scott Nichols    (2010-05-12 13:14:12)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I like things the way they are...:)


Wayne Lowrance    (2010-05-12 16:42:29)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Eliminating the voice of the players down to just one being more representative. Now that is an original thought. I think many of us here are weary of this proposal.
Thibault I trust your judgement. Whatever you wish, is ok with me.
Wayne


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-12 16:51:21)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Not exactly a vote Garvin, anyway a few opinions are much better than nothing and still matter to discuss.

My answer to Scott & Tano-Urayoán : I agree that none of these proposals is more fair than the current rules, but here is why at least choice #1 has also many advantages, for FICGS but also for the players : Of course, those who made it the hardest way like Wayne may feel that this is unfair to change the rules, but rules constantly evolve & this would be really a minor change (in the case of choice #1). The point is that while e.g. IECG uses this promotion system, it is unfair the same way that a player from IECG can register at FICGS with his IECG rating that benefited of this rule. From the start FICGS rules were harder than IECG rules when registering, but as ratings move faster here I thought that it would be a compensation, but it is not a reason enough not to improve the rules again if possible.

The reality according to me : choice #1 is less fair than current rules, and choice #4 is even more unfair, but the current rules aren't so fair either. Rules that would be completely fair may exist but would have too many bad consequences for sure, and at least FICGS would not have been a success by using it. Anyway, I will not take any decision today, let's wait for some more arguments, the whole discussion is actually even more interesting than the point that is discussed in. Finally, I'm quite favourable to try (as Garvin suggested) the choice #1 and discuss the consequences after a few months.


Daniel Parmet    (2010-05-12 20:25:24)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

I think option1 is the best. But I completely agree with Garvin. Why not try it? We tried those silly rating band idea even though we knew it was bad. Why not try this? I think its a good idea. I agree that options 2-5 are silly.

Right now as it stands, you get nothing for winning a tournament, you might not even get many points either. If you are 1990ish and beat 6 1800s. They might have been much stronger than 1800 but the results also came in slowly 1/1 for each rating period... you don't stand to gain very many points maybe not even enough to get you to the next rating band... but you would be guaranteed to play the next rating band for sure because you won the tournament. I think you'll see alot of the invitations into the rating bands helping people out that are only missing it by a few rating points anyways. Besides its a REAL prize for winning the tournament, right now all we give is a pat on the back!


Wayne Lowrance    (2010-05-13 18:20:15)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Been giving a lot of thought to this post. At first I was opposed to it. I think primarily maybe I was influenced by my thinking " I climbed through the levels", so anyone can if they dedicate the effort as I did.
Now I am swayed to support Garvin Grey posting ideas.
I recognize very well that there are many players qualified to move up but find it frustrating to make headway.

It comes down to this. Chances are if they win a class tournament, they probably deserve to advance an level. If not competitive, they will not stay at that level. So anyhow I am posting as to what I believe the proposal #1 is in fact.


- Winners of any standard (class) or rapid tournament, whatever the game, may buy a ticket for 10 Epoints to enter the waiting list for the next tournament category according the following conditions :

* No more than 2 players obtained the best score in the tournament. There's no winner otherwise.

* The player's TER must not be more than 200 points below the low rating limit of the waiting list.

* At most 2 players may buy a ticket to enter the same waiting list.

* The possibility to buy a ticket is valid up to 2 months after the end of the tournament and only after the official end of the tournament [when the tournaments list shows winners, not leaders of the tournament].

* The player's account must be credited of at least 10 Epoints. That is a paste of your thread Thibault. If that is what you and Garvin want or close to it then I say why not ! Give it a go. Wayne


Garvin Gray    (2010-05-15 11:43:02)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Thank you for your compliment Wayne.

Another benefit is that it will allow the higher divisions to fill quicker, allowing more games between the top players.

I quite often see posts asking for more players to join the top divisions. With this idea, while it will mean one person from the lower group, it will still allow more games between the 6 'genuine' people in that division.


Garvin Gray    (2010-05-15 11:45:34)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Just thought of another benefit. This idea might also get those who are just under the rating cutoff to start joining tournaments where they think there is nothing to gain except loss of rating points.

So in a 2000-2200 rating division, 2150+ might start entering knowing that they can win that division and get to the next upper division, rather than just having to get there on rating alone.

So this idea could provide a compensatory return for being in a group with 6 other people rated lower.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-15 13:22:39)
Garvin's idea

Hi Garvin, that's another interesting idea, indeed. Somewhere between choices #1 and #4, much less unfair than choice #4 though.

I have to think about it also, any opinion on this?


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-17 23:18:18)
Question

Still thinking about the last Garvin's idea... the real question is IMO: can one estimate that it is fair that a player who is 50 elo points below the rating cutoff, let's say a player rated 2150, have the same right than the winner of a previous class A tournament to buy a ticket for the next class M tournament?

There are advantages to this idea of course, a problem is that there will be even less possibilites for tournaments winners to have a ticket... (well, it goes in the other way also)

I like the idea though... My personal answer to this question would be probably: All this is far too complicated to be summarized this way to this question, winning a tournament IS a matter of chance also, winning a game IS a matter of chance (we prefer to call it statistics) also, and this rule, whatever the details, IS unfair anyway. So there is no clear answer IMHO, but if someone has one, please share it now :)


Garvin Gray    (2010-05-18 06:46:22)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

If you want a rule for this, then I guess it has to be in TER order at the time the next tournament is going to start.

But that does make setting up each tournament more complex.

Or you can let the 'market' decide for you by taking the first person to enter is the person that accepted into the higher division.


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-05-20 23:48:59)
Updated !

As you may have seen, the FICGS rules have been updated with the rule that was discussed here...

http://www.ficgs.com/membership.html#tickets

This is still an experiment, let's see the benefits (for waiting lists & future prizes), it may be changed yet.

If you just won a tournament, you should have received an email explaining all this.


Scott Nichols    (2010-08-09 21:12:59)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Just a note to say how this new rule is affecting at least one player here (me), :) I "earned" entry to a higher class tournament by winning the class just below. I paid my ten E-points and received entry into the next higher class. We have been playing for a while and I am holding my own ok. I have met new players and am overjoyed at the chance to play them. They are all friendly and welcoming. Life couldn't be better, ......but....... Maybe it's just me, but I feel at this point that I never REALLY earned my way into this realm. The old way was to suffer through months and years of climbing the rating ladder a little at a time and then finally reach that next level. Also, just my opinion, is that these days there really isn't a big difference in strengths between 1850 and 2450 given that we all have fast computers running on Rybka mostly. The difference I find is the human side of the ratings. The old days whether Shredder could beat Fritz, or Deep Junior could beat Hiarcs are long gone. So I guess what I'm trying to say without rambling any further, is that as much as I like playing in the higher section, I would prefer to "EARN" it the old way. Just one players opinion, Thank you


Thibault de Vassal    (2010-08-10 00:01:37)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

It is true that there isn't a big difference in strengths between "many" 2150 and 2450... That's a reason why this rule may be useful IMO, particularly while 2450 ratings are somewhat "protected", it is more an advantage for you than a disadvantage for 2450 players.

Anyway this is still an experiment... So far, only 2 or 3 players used such a ticket.


Don Groves    (2010-08-10 10:00:19)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Scott: In a way you did earn it, you won a next lower rated tournament which "earned" you the right to play one time in a higher rated one. The purpose is to allow players to improve their ratings faster if they are good enough to win some games at the higher rating.

As you say though, and Thibault seems to agree, with fast processors and the best software, there isn't as much difference between players as there used to be.


Paul Campanella    (2013-09-15 13:03:20)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Will this rule apply to poker and GO tournaments or just chess?


Thibault de Vassal    (2013-09-16 00:40:34)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

It applies to all games (as far as I remember :))


Paul Campanella    (2013-10-01 00:14:47)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

It's really not fair because the previous people worked their way through the ranks in order to get their ratings instead of just entering into a tournament the easier way.


Garvin Gray    (2013-10-20 12:50:19)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Was attempting to find the thread on allowing players to enter the next section up by winning the lower section.

Time for a review of this practice I think now that it has been going for a year or so.

I think it has had some benefits, I certainly have benefited from it ie have helped moved me up the rating list faster than otherwise would have occurred, I have noticed a couple of large issues.

In some groups, the waiting lists are taking much longer to form when two players from a lower rating group have entered early.

For instance a 2300+ group can be showing players with ratings of 2150 or so. This is possible when two players buy their ticket after winning a lower division and then their rating drops. This situation has occurred.

From then on for that group to form, it requires another 5 2300 players to join the group. That is a long and tedious process.

I think the rules on the upgrade ticket process need to be re-written to as follows:

A player, who has won the lower division, can only use the higher division ticket, once five or more places have been filled in that group.

The purpose of this rule change should hopefully show to keep 'strong' players that if they get in quick they can get a group going full of players of the ratings they want.

The market can then choose by entering quickly and watching the rating lists.

With the current situation of difficulty getting divisions started due to the number of wch groups started at the same time, some changes are required.

I think this rule is one area that needs to be reviewed urgently.


Thibault de Vassal    (2013-12-15 00:56:10)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Hi Garvin, sorry for the (very long) delay!

You're absolutely right here. Actually, I tried to work this way already in some cases but it was not enough, obviously...

There may be disappointments in some cases but it's probably worth a try, so the rule will be rewritten that way!


Garvin Gray    (2013-12-15 10:33:57)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Another suggestion :) I notice you have said the rule has been re-written, but where it is displayed. To make the 'ticket' rule etc more obvious, it should be contained on the page when someone clicks on the link that takes you to entering a divisions. Say I click on class sm 19 (the current division in question), it would give the ticket rules.

So, when does the new ticket rules start?


Thibault de Vassal    (2013-12-16 18:44:40)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Right now, it is fully displayed in the rules page only.

http://www.ficgs.com/membership.html#tickets

The ticket option is reminded (with a link to rules) in each email specifying that a tournament is won and on the "My messages" page. I'll probably add it to the Waiting list pages soon.

By the rules have been updated!


Alvin Alcala    (2013-12-17 17:47:32)
Entry fee for higher class tournament

Is it possible under "preferences" we have a message we earned a ticket?









 

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December 10, 2018

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